This was submitted by Jim Haley on March 27th, 2008:
Good Morning
I have a 7 year old Grandson who is asn only child of a marriage that is ending due to a somewhat bitter divorce proceeding. Noah(the Grandson) was seen by a pyschiatrist who was court ordered by the family judge who is handling the divorce. My daughter who is also Noah’s Mother was talking casually to a work acquaintance and discussing some of Noah’s symptoms and the problems he is having inside and outside school. Noah is anti-social for many of his 7 years. He has been suspended from some of his 1st grade activities and could not even handle even his own birthday party activities through his brief number of years. My daughter’s work friend told her that it appears Noah may have Asperger’s syndrome. I wonder why the older psychiatrist did not mention his possible suspicions last week when he saw both parents and Noah at his office. Noah is sharing custody with each parent–one week on and week off. The psychiatrist did suggest medications but Noah’s Father declined any medication.
We susptect that Noah’s father has displayed some anti-social behavior at times but he did marry 2 other women before my daughter–thankfully no children from the 1st 2 marriages.
I have read that a gene has not been isolated as of 2005 so all I read as a cause seems to be conjecture.
Has medication helped any of you aspies through the years?
Noah’s father even denied my daughter any social activities outside the marriage and the vie seems to be his computer and his job. He does have a good job as a video editor.
Whichever parent gets custody will be tested. Noah’s school district seems to be fairly modern in most respects. However we do not know if they have other aspies of not.
Noah has not yet been diagnosed with A.S. but the parents and Noah see the same psychiatrist next week and my daughter will bring up the subject.
Any thoughts or comments for 2 concerned grandparents???
This is my reply I wrote on March 27th:
Jim,
Your soon-to-be ex-son-in-law sounds like a wise man for declining the psychiatrist’s advice to give medication to your grandson; plus, your daughter is also wise in listening to other people who will not make a financial profit from Noah and/or this situation.
Many people wonder why psychiatrists don’t and/or can’t detect Asperger’s syndrome, so don’t feel alone. Believe this or not, but it’s true — most psychiatrists and psychologists don’t and/or can’t because they don’t want to admit that they are not knowledgeable and/or skilled enough to be able to do so. Asperger’s syndrome is too new to the mental health industry and it’s not even correctly described in their diagnostic journals. AS is too complex for most neurotypicals to grasp. Even though AS hasn’t been known about for a long time, aspies have been around since the beginning of mankind.
I was surprised to recently learn that a psychologist, who leads a group of adults with aspergers, received NO education in Aspergers while going for her psychology degree. She taught herself what she knows about Aspergers by choosing to specialize in helping clients with AS. Her clients, along with the members of this adult aspie group, are her teachers. Now she wants to write a book about it. What does this tell you?
The message I’m getting from the way you write about Noah’s father ‘thankfully having no other children’ — along with knowing what I do about courts, school systems, the mental health industry, and social services — gives me the impression that Noah is increasingly feeling ‘defective’ as he gets older. Combine that with a divorce and all else, it’s a recipe for disaster. If Noah was to receive medication (i.e., legal drugs), it might cause him to appear less anti-social . . . BUT that would be pleasing other people at Noah’s expense. Noah is not a ’sick’ boy. A person who thinks differently, but is otherwise healthy, does not need medication.
Pharmaceutical drugs are VERY dangerous. I’ve not only read endless true stories of people eventually regretting having taken them; I’m also watching how they are affecting people I know. Prescribed drugs are just like illegal ones — both might make the user feel better while under the influence (prescribed drugs can cause the user to feel ill). Drugs are not the solution to these kinds of problems. No one can ‘fix’ anything until they first know what is really wrong.
I don’t deny that Noah is anti-social. Asperger’s syndrome does explain odd behavior, but that’s as far as it goes. Society isn’t ready yet to understand the way that an AS individual thinks. That’s why the media and publishing industry give almost all of their attention exclusively to AS children and don’t allow sound minded AS adults an equal voice to be heard.
Ironically, social activities can actually perpetuate Noah’s anti-social behavior. The vicious cycle with Noah began long ago. Noah is now being blamed for not being liked by others. He has entered into the self-fulfilling prophecy of believing he is socially inferior simply because he thinks differently. This is what has been taught to him since the day his odd behavior became noticeable.
What Noah needs is to feel accepted unconditionally. He needs to feel like he has things of worth about himself which will convince him that he is equal to everyone else in value as another human being. It has to be real or else he will behave more unacceptably with others.
I can assure you that Noah’s school district has other aspies. I now know (and have evidence) that school districts do everything in their power to hide the fact that they do not want to acknowledge what students of theirs have AS unless they are forced to.
Most people know divorce has destructive consequences upon even neurotypical children. No one (including ‘professionals’) will be able to sort out what’s AS related versus divorce related. The best approach for you to begin with is to know what NOT to expect.
Don’t expect things to get better . . . at least for a long time (and that’s assuming the right kind of guidance even comes along). Friends who have been through similar things are your safest and most trustworthy sources of help.
Exercise a lot of caution when dealing with people unrelated to Noah (other than maybe real friends of your daughter who are wise and hopefully have a lot of personal experience with Aspergers).
The best thing you can do is what you and your daughter are already doing — get as informed as you can, but stay away from what you read that comes from large organizations. Focus in on what individuals have to say.
Above all . . . do NOT hate Noah’s father no matter how ugly the divorce might get. I never hated my daughter’s father even though he wasn’t around to raise her or support her financially. Now (she’s an adult with two children of her own) their father-daughter relationship is blossoming. She is extremely well-adjusted mentally and is ever so thankful to not have had to endure feeling ‘torn’ between her parents.
Take one day at a time and don’t believe everything you hear. You’re a grandfather, so you probably already know such things.
This was submitted by Jim on April 6, 2008:
Hello:
I have a 7 year old Grandson who has been diagnosed with ODD and CD and will be tested for Asperger soon. Drugs have been recommended by the psychologist but the boy’s Father has refused the drugs for his son and wants to use prayer. To complicate things more my daughter(the Mother) and the Father are getting divorced.
Have you taken drugs for your A.S. at any time? Have they done any good?
Do you feel you could have graduated from College and disregarded the H.S. counselor’s cruel opinion?
Your very literate prose makes me think you would have performed well in College.
I have been reading Tony Attwood’s latest book. Do you feel he is a good spokesperson for
Aspies?
This is my reply I wrote on April 6th:
Hi Jim,
So your Grandson has the diagnosis of Oppositional Defiant Disorder and a Communication Disorder to identify the cause of certain phenomenon going on his life. I wonder how many people notice how much the symptoms of ODD are identical to most couples getting divorced? Children will learn more from what they observe their parents doing than they will from what people tell them they should be learning.
Communication Disorders are more complex, but I don’t think it would serve much purpose for me to get into that here. What you’re asking is if I have taken drugs for AS at any time and if they’ve done any good.
To answer clearly, I need to first explain that I consider anything that can cause a chemical reaction in the body to be a ‘drug.’ I go beyond including legally prescribed drugs, all the way through the food groups, and on to include thoughts and beliefs. But I doubt that’s what you mean, so I’ll answer by saying I have never taken any ‘meds’ prescribed for any ‘mental health’ condition. I’m not totally against drugs and believe there is a place and time for most that exist, but the way the pharmaceutical industry is now working with the government, media, school districts, mental health associations, etc. has become insane.
I now know that if I took drugs for A.S. and/or underwent ongoing ‘therapy,’ I would not be as sound minded as I am now. I’m now seeing what the long-term effect of this is having on many A.S. adults. This is why I cringe over the excessive focus people place on getting rid of the ’symptoms’ of Aspergers. That is NOT the same thing as getting rid of the ’symptoms’ of comorbid conditions which are common among Aspie people. Aspergers is not a ‘medical’ issue, but the effect of being an Aspie in a NT world will bring on health related problems when a child and/or adult cannot live in a healthy mental environment. Every human being’s mind needs proper nurturing or else the body will suffer for it. Every human being’s mind doesn’t operate the same way, but yet society is demanding it does.
I did graduate from College because I disregarded the H.S. counselor’s foolish ‘professional’ opinion. This is why I get upset over so many of the tests that exist. Generally tests are okay for mainstream people, but not everyone ‘fits’ in with the way most others function. I received formal degrees in Business Administration, Graphic Design, and Psychology, but all that ‘book knowledge’ is nothing compared to personal experience and self-education (especially when students don’t get to chose what they learn once they’re under a programmed curriculum).
I also homeschooled and was able to see how being able to be flexible and adjust to a student’s personal learning style is vastly superior over teaching methods that can’t avoid stress because of so many rules and misconceptions.
You are the first person to ever tell me that I have a very literate prose! I was told in High School that my English skills are very poor, but that my mechanical aptitude (level of logic) is very high. The only reason my writing might have improved is simply because of how urgently I want to express myself and I know how judgmental people are. Aspies (myself included) tend to have poor reading comprehension. It doesn’t mean that can’t change. It just means working harder at some things than others may have to. I had to work hard in college to keep my grades on the Dean’s list. Now I understand why. The college environment isn’t conducive towards the way I think. If tests had been given to me then, I would have been labeled as being learning disabled in certain areas. When I can learn in my own way, on my own terms, that’s when my full potential comes to life. For that to happen though, only I know what works best for me. This is why I get so upset over other people thinking that they know what’s best for someone else. Children are made to listen to adults and are judged for questioning them, which is fine for the most part . . . but when a child is being led wrong by someone who he has to trust, then it should be that the child is listened to. He should not only get to ask as many ‘why’ questions as he wants to whomever he feels most comfortable to ask, but also adults in charge should be doing the same thing (except for most of them, the problem is that they’re too comfortable asking the wrong people for answers). Communication and learning is a two-way street.
It is possible that your Grandson’s Father’s prayers have led you to search for answers in multiple places. That right there is a good sign, because there is safety in exploring all the options for help that are available today. A general good rule of thumb to follow is: If it’s quick and easy, then be suspicious. Pills are no substitute for time, work, and love. If it’s slow and difficult, plus involves a substantial amount of money, then be cautious too (as in the case of permanently recurring appointments to the psychologist’s and/or psychiatrist’s office). I don’t know how you ended up finding my blog, but I would guess it wasn’t from hearing about it on the news through television.
I’m not sure if Tony Attwood’s latest book is “The Complete Guide to Asperger’s Syndrome,” but if that’s the book you’re reading, then he is an excellent spokesperson for Aspies. He isn’t perfect, but at least he has a much better perspective than most others who are doing the same thing.
Jim, your Grandson is so blessed to have you! I often wonder how different my life would have become if I had support instead of problems on top of problems. But then, I wouldn’t know what I know now and I wouldn’t be as happy as I am today . . . and that’s without drugs!
Jim replies back the next day on April 7th by saying:
Hello:
Greetings from Beaver Dams, NY. It appears that tou might also live in NY. We have seen bear in our front yard and a friend had a cat killed by a coyote at a nearby golf course.
You guessed right on the book. Tony Attwood will be appearing personally in both Buffalo and Utica in July this year. If the conference fee is not too expensive and my Grandson is also diagnosed with Aspergers, I may go to see Mr Attwood.
The CD I mentioned is actually Conduct Disorder which is probably more troublesome than Communication disorder.
My grandson is in 1st grade in another State and is having major problems with controlling his anger towards his classmates and has been temporarily suspended twice He has also been seen by a divorce-court ordered psychologist who is the Doctor who wants to put him on meds to control both his fits of anger and depression. He has no friends at school, refuses to do his homework. becomes very angry with my daughter(his mother), kicks her Labrador dog etc etc. My daughter reports that our Grandson will probably be put in Special Ed classes soon due to anger and inability to interact with his classmates. He is intelligent and for that reason, he has not fallen behind in his classwork YET.
I read in your blog that you have not used Doctors too much. It appears the pending divorce and his behavior in school and probable Aspergers diagnosis have all helped to create the perfect storm with respect to my grandson. His Father feels there is nothing wrong that prayer will not cure.
Thanks for responding. Your comments are quite intuitive and very interesting with respect to any meds for your AS. Do you have any suggestions for a beleaguered Grandfather about 500 miles away from this sad situation?
This is my reply to Jim on that same day of April 7th:
Hi Jim,
I guess coyotes are all over New York State. Where I am there are many. I think you will find that whatever the fee may be for seeing Tony Attwood, if your Grandson is diagnosed with Aspergers, you will not regret whatever sacrifice you might make in order to see him.
Your Grandson’s situation sounds awful for a boy who is only 7 yrs. old. Prayer only works when people are willing to lay down their life for doing what’s right. I don’t know how people make it through life without faith and prayer, but I do know that God works in strange ways. It’s just that when you’re in the middle of something so trying as what you’re describing in your family’s life, you want more.
The best suggestion I can offer is that you don’t panic and take one day at a time. If it’s any encouragement, it’s a wonderful sign that you are going in the right direction so far. You have many people with Aspergers and AS children online who will offer a lot of support. For now, read and learn as much as you can. I guess I don’t need to tell you that court ordered situations can create trouble on top of trouble.
There might be no choice when it comes to your Grandson being put on meds because he is in ‘the system.’ I feel so bad for him. He has to be hurting big time to be kicking a dog. Is your Grandson close to you (does he trust you)?
